We have for years had a great cooperation with our Chinese friends, who have been able to purchase kbmMW Enterprise Edition licenses for a country specific low price. It has resulted in more than hundred Delphi developers using legally licensed kbmMW in China.
It is has been a mutual beneficial agreement, since C4D obviously prefer people around the world to use licensed rather than pirate copies of our software.
However with the latest condemnations from China of the sanctions imposed by EU and the west against Putins extreme aggression against Ukraine, who is a neighbour to the EU, and who do not deserve becoming a vassal state of the type of Russia we are seeing now, under Putins rule, I have decided to put the agreement with our Chinese friends on hold.
I can’t have a clean conscience supporting (even how slightly that is) the Chinese government’s stance on the atrocities happening towards the Ukrainian people. A stance most likely fuelled by China’s similar ambitions to take over Taiwan in due course.
I feel so sorry for having to do this as I have many good relations with individual Chinese people.
I am also considering completely banning sales to Russia, although that may come automatically by the sanctions imposed.
I am in awe and respect for the Russians within Russia that have the courage to stand up against the war in Ukraine, and I really wish for those to succeed in bringing back a Russia that is governed by fairness and respect for humans rather than what you have right now.
21 thoughts on “Changes to sale to China and Russia”
This is European hypocrisy. Why didn’t Europeans talk to those who lost their lives in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, Palestine and Africa because of the war launched by Europe and the United States? I can only say fuck you.
And yet another mature comment from a confused Chinese citizen (37540862@qq.com)
But I suppose I can get out of it that it is strengthening my stance on the decision.
Certain people just want to have everything for nothing.
Go donate money to Ukraine and you can get a f…. license yourself instead of acting as a moron, but you will have to come out of hiding!
Hi Chinese cowardly anonymous friend from Hongkong.
You know what is double standard? You complaining about having to pay the SAME PRICE as everybody else for my products!
The SAME PRICE the people of the USA has been paying all the time!
You most likely do not even have an interest in using it in the first place. But you still feel compelled to complain.
Now you can get it _EVEN_ cheaper than the agreement that has been POSTPONED or PUT ON PAUSE if you do not understand what I mean by postsponed.. Just show your compassion with the people of the sovereign country of Ukraine, and DONATE some money. Then you can also get a f…. license for almost no money. But you will have to come out of hiding… guitar player 😉
/Kim
What Ukraine is to Russia is different from what Taiwan and Hong Kong are to China. No country will tolerate a part of its territory being divided from it. The U.S. has done a lot of things against China over the years to hinder its rise, but of course all of them are disguised in a so-called democratic veneer, which is very confusing to the general public. The conflict between Russia and Ukraine is actually a Russian-American conflict. Ukraine is just taking a beating for the United States. Faced with the pressure of NATO’s eastward expansion, Putin has no choice. Over the years you should have heard the contradiction between the promise that NATO will never expand east and the fact that NATO is expanding east. This is also why there is a lot of public opinion from Chinese folk in favor of Russia. I can’t imagine that when you you are faced with continuous provocations from others you will always exercise restraint and forbearance. I don’t think there is any justice in tying your business to the complex game of international politics, rather it is a very funny thing.
Hi Helle.
Thank you for your actual attempt to enter a debate, rather than just using name calling.
I would first like to know why none of the commenters here has the courage to stand up for their opinions by not being anonymous? I write on my company’s blog using my name, and is facing all sorts of potential problems standing up for my opinion, but all those who have a differing opinion or just dislike me or my actions, are ANONYMOUS?
Where is the courage? Where is the spine? Where is the honour?
Ok… back to your points.
“What Ukraine is to Russia is different from what Taiwan and Hong Kong are to China”
Is that not what all people are using as an excuse for their cause being more important than some other people cause? “You can’t compare”
Putin has said directly that Ukraine is not a country. It should never have been a country. It has always been a part of Russia and is the brothers and sisters of Russian. How does that statement differ from the statements about Taiwan? Please enlighten me. Not with propaganda, but with ACTUAL facts.
“No country will tolerate a part of its territory being divided from it” – Well the truth being told The island that today is called Taiwan was under control by indigenous non Chinese people until the Dutch took over the ruling of the island. So in all fairness, it is a self imposed idea that it is part of China.
At some point warlords in China went to war against each other, and one of them kicked the Dutch out and moved to the island because he lost the war against the dynasty that became the foundation of current China.
So again it was not a Chinese island. It was an island with an exiled Chinese ruling it, but definitely not some that were happy about the people ruling China at the time.
40 years later that exiled Chinese was also conquered by the ruling Chinese from mainland China and parts of Taiwan came under Qing rule
But in 1895 it became a Japanese island after yet another war.
Then in 1945, when the Japanese were defeated, the Chinese moved in on the island again, for 4 years. Then another war, this time a civilian one in mainland China, where another looser of that battle relocated to Taiwan. Again an exile.
Then came in 1980 a democratic reform, and the Taiwan we more or less know today.
So how China can claim that Taiwan, that very specifically and with a huge majority do not want to be part of China, is part of China, is a serious mystery to me. Current China has only ruled the islands for an extremely short period of the islands inhabited times, and it seemingly have never been in any peacefully way, so I do not blame the Taiwanese to pursue their own future.
Like Russia, China is a huge country. The few extra square miles of Taiwan or Ukraine should matter nothing in terms of space, so why is it that Ukraine and Taiwan are not allowed to pursue own happiness?
Is it an envy that they are actually doing better than Russia and China?
It is not Ukraines or Taiwans fault. It is the fault of the Russian and Chinese leaders (although I would say both were doing better and better all the way until this stupid conflict that are costing the lives not only of Russian and Ukrainian soldiers, but lots of children!
Anybody who are trying to make this war acceptable in any way will have to live with the death of children on their conscience.
Consider for a moment if it would be YOUR children. You would find country XXXXX invading your neighbourhood, shelling your house, killing your wife and your kids.
How would you feel when the other side is using as a reason… “you are my brothers and sisters, you belong with us!”
“NATO expanding east”
No that is a lie constantly being peddled. What is happening is not that NATO is invading countries forcing them to be members. What is happening is that countries actively and with extreme passion want to be part of the NATO and EU communities. Why is it like that?
Because they have already been under the “protection” of the Soviet Union, in which they were not treated as equals, and with safety in mind. If they would have enjoyed being part of that union, the Soviet Union and Warsaw pact would never have ended. It did, because of the way it was run.
And right now Putin is proving they were right in asking for NATO membership. The ones already part of NATO, knew the time would come, when some idiot in Russia would become powerful enough that he could assign dictatorial properties on himself, that would make him able to redo a new USSR v2.
So the proof is in the pudding.
NATO is not expanding, but countries are fleeing to it…. now proven with good reason.
China is attempting to show as the reasonable country with ability to clearly think things thru, to work for the peaceful aspect of living etc. So why did they not directly say to Russia… Hey… this is not acceptable. We do not support that type of aggression. It will hurt not only soldiers but children too!
Instead China is working against the community trying to empower Ukraine to keep its country, while being attacked with an overwhelming force.
“I don’t think there is any justice in tying your business to the complex game of international politics, rather it is a very funny thing.”
That is the problem Helle… It is not funny at all! Would it be funny if it were your children? As I like to say to others… DO NOT BE A MORON.
Hello,
What Russia does is clearly an invasion of another sovereign country, just as was what NATO countries have done to Serbia. These are facts, but why they happened can be interpreted by anyone. I feel sorry for all Ukraine civilians and especially Ukraine citizens of Russian ethnicity in Donbass area, who have suffered indescribable atrocities from Ukraine military units such as the Azov battalion.
What does it have to do with China or Chinese developers? It is a fact that the Chinese government is not as enthusiastic as NATO countries to impose sanctions against Russia, it voted abstention during UN meeting for this purpose, but at the same time countries of almost half the population of the world voted abstention: India, Pakistan, Iran, Iraq… Unfortunately, in politics “abstention” itself is a strong strong opinion. But it seems that it bothers you that others don’t agree with you and don’t do what you want them to.
In your announce, you said “I can’t have a clean conscience supporting (even how slightly that is) the Chinese government’s stance on the atrocities happening towards the Ukrainian people. A stance most likely fueled by China’s similar ambitions to take over Taiwan in due course.”, I think this is what makes people frown because the second half was pure speculation, how could you know? And use it as an argument to justify your decision?
Also, you seem to jump to conclusions concerning Taiwan without much fact checking. When the Japs surrendered in 1945, they were forced to return all occupied territories according to Potsdam Declaration. To whom? Of course the official government which was POC back then. As you said later on, there was a civil war at the end of which POC defected to Taiwan island, part of China under the government POC. Then this civil war is never ended because there is no truce agreement signed, of course as you can guess that’s because of US military interference for their interests to keep a separated China. So the reality is complicated but very clear: Taiwan is part of China. The problem is who represents China, PRC or POC? Well, it is again complicated and clear: the winner the civil war, which isn’t ended yet even though there is no major casualty or any at all. If you still believe Taiwan and Ukraine are the same situation, I challenge you to find a UN document that states Taiwan is a country, or any document at all from US/EU.
You mentioned also that “NATO is not expanding, people are fleeing to NATO”. Well again, the fact is NATO expansion happened, as for why it happened, I am sure that you will hear different opinions from NATO and from Russia. NATO would tell you the countries wanted to join, Russia would tell you NATO initiated it. Of course you choose to ignore Russia, I’d imagine?
At last, you don’t have any “potential risk”, the politically correct environment forces people to take a stance against Russia, people cannot have no opinion on the war, look at what happens to Russian footballers, orchestra conductors, ballet dancers, Russian literature, music, cats, trees… So deep down, you know very well that you are safely on a moral high land, there is no risk.
So back to your announce to Chinese/Russian developers, apart from your sincere worries of Ukraine civilians (except the Donbass residents of Russain ethnicity perhaps), as most people will share, I see you basically try to force users of your product to agree with your stance, and hopefully they can force their government to agree with the stance of your government. It still baffles me why China is singled out, the other countries who don’t sanction Russia for the moment, don’t seem to get the equal anger/concern from you.
I am a developer, I am Chinese, I live in France, I do my part to reduce a little bit of pain for Ukraine civilians, but other than that, there is really nothing I see myself fit doing.I am very disappointed how the tech communities have become facing political matters. I hope that one day you won’t ban Chinese developers because their government doesn’t agree with Greta Thunberg.
Thank you for providing a true debate on this. This is how things should be. Also between Russia and the world.
Unfortunately that is not what is going on.
I am fully aware that it is not the individual Chinese citizen, nor the individual Russian citizen that bear the full responsibility of such things happening, but it is indeed those people who, in the end, have the most potential influence on their own governments.
Apart from war, where people turn physical weapons against each other, a slightly more “humane” option is to use sanctions. EU and the USA have imposed “light” sanctions against Russia since the Russian invasion into Ukraine in 2014. But with this full scale invasion, very hard targeted sanctions were introduced, sanctions that are also hurting the west. So we are not doing it for own pleasure, but because we simply can’t tolerate Russia to gobble up Ukraine as if it was a simple package. We are talking about people here! Not things. Those people have expressed no interest in being part of Russia, so Russia should respect that.
Further letting Russia take over Ukraine without the strongest protest and resistance from the west, would allow Putins megalomania to threaten the rest of Europe, which is absolutely not something we want to happen! And I am surprised that China do not see that as an existential threat towards itself. If Russia gets to gobble up Europe, because we all should be so understanding, when will they turn towards China?
It will not go that way. The reason is that Europe as a whole + the USA + many more countries around the world (in fact 150 or so of them) do not condone what is happening.
But China started out with directly condemning the sanctions. Later the Chinese government have soften up that stance somewhat, and why do you think that is? If it was zen to condemn, why has that stance softened? It shows that the Chinese govt. (of course) are doing what they think is best for China. They are not doing it for the wellbeing of the world. In that calculation, Ukraine may easily be sacrificable, but for Europe it is a completely different equation, where Ukraine obviously must be able to remain a free and sovereign country.
I may actually have been the first company to talk about boycotting Russia in the West, but as you may see now, almost all are. It should send a signal about where our red lines goes. And that signal should be read and understood also by the Chinese govt. and I actually think it is understood by now.
The countries you mention, that decided to abstain, all have close business and defence relations with Russia. So it is not so much of a surprise. Or actually – it was – in relation to India. I did not know India were so close in bed with Putin that they seemingly are, but I learned that the Modi government entered into close defence cooperation with Russia so that mostly explained that part.
Hence the countries abstaining are doing so because of defence and business reasons. It has nothing to do with trying to prevent a greater catastrophe or to make life easier for the victims (right now Ukraine).
I can easily see what is going to happen…. The west will stop buying oil and gas from Russia, Russia will sell that to China to recoup losses. China will use the energy to produce solar panels and batteries for the West, essentially making especially Russia dependant on China resulting in the power relationship changing between the two powers, in China’s favour. That is obviously brilliantly played for local Chinese interests, but do not expect the west to have the same interest, and thus expect the west to act differently, for example with even more interest in Taiwan and moving more production out of China.
What is going on is a nasty power game, and it is hurting children and what makes this conflict different to all the other atrocities that also hurts children, is that if this is not stopped here, it might end up hurting my own children! It is not a “simple” war between to minor nations. It is a potential complete change of world order with potentially unseen consequences for mankind!
So to sum it up. I have for years provided a deal for Chinese people that were far better than deals for any other country. So it is not like I have been punishing Chinese. In fact Chinese have been favoured for a long time, and that favoritism has now ended, since Chinese (as a govt.) actively is assisting someone that in the end is trying to hurt me, my family and my country. In the process towards that, they are going to hurt Ukraine, Moldova, Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia and Poland. That is on the menu at the moment for Putin!
And that is simply not going to happen, with or without the help of China.
Regarding NATO and expansion. Why do you not ask the countries that asked to join NATO why they did? If they were pressured into it from NATO? I think you will find that they did so due to the explanation I provided. The only villain in that situation is the entity they are trying to escape from… Russia.
Let me use an analogy. If someone came and wanted to kill you in your house, and you decide to escape from the house to a police station, who then prevents you from being killed, will you then shout “police state!” since the police obviously has expanded into your house? Or would you be happy they saved you and allowed you to be in a safe haven?
When NATO broke its promise to expand eastward some years ago, why didn’t Your Excellency cancel the license of your software in EU countries? Now that Russia has been pushed to the point of no return, thus taking military action against Ukraine, you only see the invasion without seeing the reason for it? It was NATO that acted as a pusher to direct Russia’s military action.
Hi Mirroland you anonymous coward with a fake email address, writing from China (thinkday@vim.com)!
Please see above for my reply to Helle.
Oh…..I almost forgot! Do not be a moron!
Kim/C4D
What a sick brain, pure Neo Nazi!
(snip) lots of drivel(/snip)You are not even as good as the devil!(snip) more drivel (/snip) Boasting yourself on the moral commanding height, you are doing the acts of bandits and genocide against Indians and Australian Aborigines. You are not even as good as animals!
Is this really the best you can do? No arguments? No debate? No reasoning? Pure childish animalistic feelings?
What are you afraid of? Why do you not dare to engage brain? Why is the only thing you can do, is to spew insults.
Mind you, 8 out of 10 replies I have got, are Chinese people throwing childish insults, going completely berserk.
1 of 10 is a Russian debating civilized and 1 of 10 is a Chinese trying to explain the stance.
But 8 out of 10 CHINESE people do not have the brain or courage to actually argue. Is it only children sitting behind the computers with a huge list of insults they can copy from?
The Russians never had such a good deal like you Chinese had. And still you complain. That type of behaviour, with the rest of the Chinese silently condoning it, makes it much less likely that the decision I made was only for a period of time.
Yet another anonymous Chinese coward acting like a moron. (sunx@163.com)
One that apparently is also illiterate, since that charming spew of crap has been put out here before and answered.
You do not deserve a reply for being a moron.
Kim/C4D
Yet another anonymous Chinese coward (305230354@qq.com).
Don’t you think it is going that way all by itself now?
Russians can’t buy since there is no practically working international transactions going on, and Chinese like you will choose to boycott somebody like me?
Kim/C4D
This is European hypocrisy. Why didn’t Europeans talk to those who lost their lives in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, Palestine and Africa because of the war launched by Europe and the United States? I can only say fuck you.
这就是欧洲人的虚伪。那些因为欧洲和美国发动战争失去生命的人，如伊拉克、利比亚、叙利亚、阿富汗、巴勒斯坦和非洲，欧洲人当时怎么不跳出来当圣母婊？我只能说操你大爷。
And yet another mature comment from a confused Chinese citizen (37540862@qq.com)
But I suppose I can get out of it that it is strengthening my stance on the decision.
Certain people just want to have everything for nothing.
Go donate money to Ukraine and you can get a f…. license yourself instead of acting as a moron, but you will have to come out of hiding!
fuck your mother.
A very mature comment by a very confused Chinese citizen (1233344442@qq.com)
Come on, please behave yourself, you can have different opinions, but don’t embarrass yourself, or our race. Thanks.
US Kill milions people for years。
its time to change sale to USA.right?
double standard is your face~~
Hi Chinese cowardly anonymous friend from Hongkong.
You know what is double standard? You complaining about having to pay the SAME PRICE as everybody else for my products!
The SAME PRICE the people of the USA has been paying all the time!
You most likely do not even have an interest in using it in the first place. But you still feel compelled to complain.
Now you can get it _EVEN_ cheaper than the agreement that has been POSTPONED or PUT ON PAUSE if you do not understand what I mean by postsponed.. Just show your compassion with the people of the sovereign country of Ukraine, and DONATE some money. Then you can also get a f…. license for almost no money. But you will have to come out of hiding… guitar player 😉
/Kim
Should Close sale to china and russia and America Immediately！just do it~~~
And you should stop being a dick! Just do it!
What Ukraine is to Russia is different from what Taiwan and Hong Kong are to China. No country will tolerate a part of its territory being divided from it. The U.S. has done a lot of things against China over the years to hinder its rise, but of course all of them are disguised in a so-called democratic veneer, which is very confusing to the general public. The conflict between Russia and Ukraine is actually a Russian-American conflict. Ukraine is just taking a beating for the United States. Faced with the pressure of NATO’s eastward expansion, Putin has no choice. Over the years you should have heard the contradiction between the promise that NATO will never expand east and the fact that NATO is expanding east. This is also why there is a lot of public opinion from Chinese folk in favor of Russia. I can’t imagine that when you you are faced with continuous provocations from others you will always exercise restraint and forbearance. I don’t think there is any justice in tying your business to the complex game of international politics, rather it is a very funny thing.
Hi Helle.
Thank you for your actual attempt to enter a debate, rather than just using name calling.
I would first like to know why none of the commenters here has the courage to stand up for their opinions by not being anonymous? I write on my company’s blog using my name, and is facing all sorts of potential problems standing up for my opinion, but all those who have a differing opinion or just dislike me or my actions, are ANONYMOUS?
Where is the courage? Where is the spine? Where is the honour?
Ok… back to your points.
“What Ukraine is to Russia is different from what Taiwan and Hong Kong are to China”
Is that not what all people are using as an excuse for their cause being more important than some other people cause? “You can’t compare”
Putin has said directly that Ukraine is not a country. It should never have been a country. It has always been a part of Russia and is the brothers and sisters of Russian. How does that statement differ from the statements about Taiwan? Please enlighten me. Not with propaganda, but with ACTUAL facts.
“No country will tolerate a part of its territory being divided from it” – Well the truth being told The island that today is called Taiwan was under control by indigenous non Chinese people until the Dutch took over the ruling of the island. So in all fairness, it is a self imposed idea that it is part of China.
At some point warlords in China went to war against each other, and one of them kicked the Dutch out and moved to the island because he lost the war against the dynasty that became the foundation of current China.
So again it was not a Chinese island. It was an island with an exiled Chinese ruling it, but definitely not some that were happy about the people ruling China at the time.
40 years later that exiled Chinese was also conquered by the ruling Chinese from mainland China and parts of Taiwan came under Qing rule
But in 1895 it became a Japanese island after yet another war.
Then in 1945, when the Japanese were defeated, the Chinese moved in on the island again, for 4 years. Then another war, this time a civilian one in mainland China, where another looser of that battle relocated to Taiwan. Again an exile.
Then came in 1980 a democratic reform, and the Taiwan we more or less know today.
So how China can claim that Taiwan, that very specifically and with a huge majority do not want to be part of China, is part of China, is a serious mystery to me. Current China has only ruled the islands for an extremely short period of the islands inhabited times, and it seemingly have never been in any peacefully way, so I do not blame the Taiwanese to pursue their own future.
Like Russia, China is a huge country. The few extra square miles of Taiwan or Ukraine should matter nothing in terms of space, so why is it that Ukraine and Taiwan are not allowed to pursue own happiness?
Is it an envy that they are actually doing better than Russia and China?
It is not Ukraines or Taiwans fault. It is the fault of the Russian and Chinese leaders (although I would say both were doing better and better all the way until this stupid conflict that are costing the lives not only of Russian and Ukrainian soldiers, but lots of children!
Anybody who are trying to make this war acceptable in any way will have to live with the death of children on their conscience.
Consider for a moment if it would be YOUR children. You would find country XXXXX invading your neighbourhood, shelling your house, killing your wife and your kids.
How would you feel when the other side is using as a reason… “you are my brothers and sisters, you belong with us!”
“NATO expanding east”
No that is a lie constantly being peddled. What is happening is not that NATO is invading countries forcing them to be members. What is happening is that countries actively and with extreme passion want to be part of the NATO and EU communities. Why is it like that?
Because they have already been under the “protection” of the Soviet Union, in which they were not treated as equals, and with safety in mind. If they would have enjoyed being part of that union, the Soviet Union and Warsaw pact would never have ended. It did, because of the way it was run.
And right now Putin is proving they were right in asking for NATO membership. The ones already part of NATO, knew the time would come, when some idiot in Russia would become powerful enough that he could assign dictatorial properties on himself, that would make him able to redo a new USSR v2.
So the proof is in the pudding.
NATO is not expanding, but countries are fleeing to it…. now proven with good reason.
China is attempting to show as the reasonable country with ability to clearly think things thru, to work for the peaceful aspect of living etc. So why did they not directly say to Russia… Hey… this is not acceptable. We do not support that type of aggression. It will hurt not only soldiers but children too!
Instead China is working against the community trying to empower Ukraine to keep its country, while being attacked with an overwhelming force.
“I don’t think there is any justice in tying your business to the complex game of international politics, rather it is a very funny thing.”
That is the problem Helle… It is not funny at all! Would it be funny if it were your children? As I like to say to others… DO NOT BE A MORON.
Kim/C4D
Hello,
What Russia does is clearly an invasion of another sovereign country, just as was what NATO countries have done to Serbia. These are facts, but why they happened can be interpreted by anyone. I feel sorry for all Ukraine civilians and especially Ukraine citizens of Russian ethnicity in Donbass area, who have suffered indescribable atrocities from Ukraine military units such as the Azov battalion.
What does it have to do with China or Chinese developers? It is a fact that the Chinese government is not as enthusiastic as NATO countries to impose sanctions against Russia, it voted abstention during UN meeting for this purpose, but at the same time countries of almost half the population of the world voted abstention: India, Pakistan, Iran, Iraq… Unfortunately, in politics “abstention” itself is a strong strong opinion. But it seems that it bothers you that others don’t agree with you and don’t do what you want them to.
In your announce, you said “I can’t have a clean conscience supporting (even how slightly that is) the Chinese government’s stance on the atrocities happening towards the Ukrainian people. A stance most likely fueled by China’s similar ambitions to take over Taiwan in due course.”, I think this is what makes people frown because the second half was pure speculation, how could you know? And use it as an argument to justify your decision?
Also, you seem to jump to conclusions concerning Taiwan without much fact checking. When the Japs surrendered in 1945, they were forced to return all occupied territories according to Potsdam Declaration. To whom? Of course the official government which was POC back then. As you said later on, there was a civil war at the end of which POC defected to Taiwan island, part of China under the government POC. Then this civil war is never ended because there is no truce agreement signed, of course as you can guess that’s because of US military interference for their interests to keep a separated China. So the reality is complicated but very clear: Taiwan is part of China. The problem is who represents China, PRC or POC? Well, it is again complicated and clear: the winner the civil war, which isn’t ended yet even though there is no major casualty or any at all. If you still believe Taiwan and Ukraine are the same situation, I challenge you to find a UN document that states Taiwan is a country, or any document at all from US/EU.
You mentioned also that “NATO is not expanding, people are fleeing to NATO”. Well again, the fact is NATO expansion happened, as for why it happened, I am sure that you will hear different opinions from NATO and from Russia. NATO would tell you the countries wanted to join, Russia would tell you NATO initiated it. Of course you choose to ignore Russia, I’d imagine?
At last, you don’t have any “potential risk”, the politically correct environment forces people to take a stance against Russia, people cannot have no opinion on the war, look at what happens to Russian footballers, orchestra conductors, ballet dancers, Russian literature, music, cats, trees… So deep down, you know very well that you are safely on a moral high land, there is no risk.
So back to your announce to Chinese/Russian developers, apart from your sincere worries of Ukraine civilians (except the Donbass residents of Russain ethnicity perhaps), as most people will share, I see you basically try to force users of your product to agree with your stance, and hopefully they can force their government to agree with the stance of your government. It still baffles me why China is singled out, the other countries who don’t sanction Russia for the moment, don’t seem to get the equal anger/concern from you.
I am a developer, I am Chinese, I live in France, I do my part to reduce a little bit of pain for Ukraine civilians, but other than that, there is really nothing I see myself fit doing.I am very disappointed how the tech communities have become facing political matters. I hope that one day you won’t ban Chinese developers because their government doesn’t agree with Greta Thunberg.
Hi Tonyk
Thank you for providing a true debate on this. This is how things should be. Also between Russia and the world.
Unfortunately that is not what is going on.
I am fully aware that it is not the individual Chinese citizen, nor the individual Russian citizen that bear the full responsibility of such things happening, but it is indeed those people who, in the end, have the most potential influence on their own governments.
Apart from war, where people turn physical weapons against each other, a slightly more “humane” option is to use sanctions. EU and the USA have imposed “light” sanctions against Russia since the Russian invasion into Ukraine in 2014. But with this full scale invasion, very hard targeted sanctions were introduced, sanctions that are also hurting the west. So we are not doing it for own pleasure, but because we simply can’t tolerate Russia to gobble up Ukraine as if it was a simple package. We are talking about people here! Not things. Those people have expressed no interest in being part of Russia, so Russia should respect that.
Further letting Russia take over Ukraine without the strongest protest and resistance from the west, would allow Putins megalomania to threaten the rest of Europe, which is absolutely not something we want to happen! And I am surprised that China do not see that as an existential threat towards itself. If Russia gets to gobble up Europe, because we all should be so understanding, when will they turn towards China?
It will not go that way. The reason is that Europe as a whole + the USA + many more countries around the world (in fact 150 or so of them) do not condone what is happening.
But China started out with directly condemning the sanctions. Later the Chinese government have soften up that stance somewhat, and why do you think that is? If it was zen to condemn, why has that stance softened? It shows that the Chinese govt. (of course) are doing what they think is best for China. They are not doing it for the wellbeing of the world. In that calculation, Ukraine may easily be sacrificable, but for Europe it is a completely different equation, where Ukraine obviously must be able to remain a free and sovereign country.
I may actually have been the first company to talk about boycotting Russia in the West, but as you may see now, almost all are. It should send a signal about where our red lines goes. And that signal should be read and understood also by the Chinese govt. and I actually think it is understood by now.
The countries you mention, that decided to abstain, all have close business and defence relations with Russia. So it is not so much of a surprise. Or actually – it was – in relation to India. I did not know India were so close in bed with Putin that they seemingly are, but I learned that the Modi government entered into close defence cooperation with Russia so that mostly explained that part.
Hence the countries abstaining are doing so because of defence and business reasons. It has nothing to do with trying to prevent a greater catastrophe or to make life easier for the victims (right now Ukraine).
I can easily see what is going to happen…. The west will stop buying oil and gas from Russia, Russia will sell that to China to recoup losses. China will use the energy to produce solar panels and batteries for the West, essentially making especially Russia dependant on China resulting in the power relationship changing between the two powers, in China’s favour. That is obviously brilliantly played for local Chinese interests, but do not expect the west to have the same interest, and thus expect the west to act differently, for example with even more interest in Taiwan and moving more production out of China.
What is going on is a nasty power game, and it is hurting children and what makes this conflict different to all the other atrocities that also hurts children, is that if this is not stopped here, it might end up hurting my own children! It is not a “simple” war between to minor nations. It is a potential complete change of world order with potentially unseen consequences for mankind!
So to sum it up. I have for years provided a deal for Chinese people that were far better than deals for any other country. So it is not like I have been punishing Chinese. In fact Chinese have been favoured for a long time, and that favoritism has now ended, since Chinese (as a govt.) actively is assisting someone that in the end is trying to hurt me, my family and my country. In the process towards that, they are going to hurt Ukraine, Moldova, Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia and Poland. That is on the menu at the moment for Putin!
And that is simply not going to happen, with or without the help of China.
Regarding NATO and expansion. Why do you not ask the countries that asked to join NATO why they did? If they were pressured into it from NATO? I think you will find that they did so due to the explanation I provided. The only villain in that situation is the entity they are trying to escape from… Russia.
Let me use an analogy. If someone came and wanted to kill you in your house, and you decide to escape from the house to a police station, who then prevents you from being killed, will you then shout “police state!” since the police obviously has expanded into your house? Or would you be happy they saved you and allowed you to be in a safe haven?
Kim/C4D
When NATO broke its promise to expand eastward some years ago, why didn’t Your Excellency cancel the license of your software in EU countries? Now that Russia has been pushed to the point of no return, thus taking military action against Ukraine, you only see the invasion without seeing the reason for it? It was NATO that acted as a pusher to direct Russia’s military action.
Hi Mirroland you anonymous coward with a fake email address, writing from China (thinkday@vim.com)!
Please see above for my reply to Helle.
Oh…..I almost forgot! Do not be a moron!
Kim/C4D
What a sick brain, pure Neo Nazi!
(snip) lots of drivel(/snip)You are not even as good as the devil!(snip) more drivel (/snip) Boasting yourself on the moral commanding height, you are doing the acts of bandits and genocide against Indians and Australian Aborigines. You are not even as good as animals!
Hi Nidaye….
Is this really the best you can do? No arguments? No debate? No reasoning? Pure childish animalistic feelings?
What are you afraid of? Why do you not dare to engage brain? Why is the only thing you can do, is to spew insults.
Mind you, 8 out of 10 replies I have got, are Chinese people throwing childish insults, going completely berserk.
1 of 10 is a Russian debating civilized and 1 of 10 is a Chinese trying to explain the stance.
But 8 out of 10 CHINESE people do not have the brain or courage to actually argue. Is it only children sitting behind the computers with a huge list of insults they can copy from?
The Russians never had such a good deal like you Chinese had. And still you complain. That type of behaviour, with the rest of the Chinese silently condoning it, makes it much less likely that the decision I made was only for a period of time.
Stop being a MORON you anonymous coward!
US Kill milions people for years in Iraq Syria etc。
its time to change sale to USA.right?
double standard is your face。Are you the running dog of US？
Yet another anonymous Chinese coward acting like a moron. (sunx@163.com)
One that apparently is also illiterate, since that charming spew of crap has been put out here before and answered.
You do not deserve a reply for being a moron.
Kim/C4D
请直接停止对中国用户 俄罗斯用户的销售，且永远不要更改。
Just Stop sale to Chinese and Russians forever.
Yet another anonymous Chinese coward (305230354@qq.com).
Don’t you think it is going that way all by itself now?
Russians can’t buy since there is no practically working international transactions going on, and Chinese like you will choose to boycott somebody like me?
Kim/C4D